Colombo & Bariani cams - total disaster - avoid!
Posted: June 5th, 2018, 7:29 pm
Recent catastrophic failure of C&B cams on a GC built 8V Integrale.
1. Cams bought from them for a Lancia 8v Integrale started to wear out within 10 minutes, metal debris all over the engine..
2. Tested for hardness by Rockwell method by my respected neighbours A Green Engineering Ltd by an ex-aerospace inspector - not heat-treated at all. Returned to C&B at MY cost! Results invalid according to owner of C&B - Vickers hardness testing method must only be used! Vickers testing done at cost to me! Results sent to C&B!
3. Total 7 months of trying to get C&B owner Alessandro Bariani to admit liability and pay for the entire engine rebuild
4. Grudging 'insurance payout' from C&B eventually that would not cover even 1/2 the cost of a total engine rebuild, removal from the car, re-installation, 3 days or more of the time of an expert consultant recommended by me - Nikola Radenkovich (founder of RP Labs) on site in Lancashire - having flown-in specially for the job, far less my time messing about doing emails to sort this mess out... Mr Bariani complained about how many emails he had to deal with to get the insurance payout. He even went so far as to say by email (I have all the records) that if we took C&B to court it would take YEARS to achieve a settlement. Not really what I want to hear from Italy's most 'respected' and oldest camshaft manufacturer - is it?
I myself would have covered the costs from my firm IMMEDIATELY. Fortunately - legally - I did not buy the cams, Tom Frame did. I am saddened that I recommended C&B but I trusted them. I no longer do nor ever will again
5. Replacement cams supplied by C&B as soft as raw En24T, colored like they were heat treated. They were not, They were about 32 HRc. Nowhere near the Rockwell or Vickers hardness specified to me by email by Mr Bariani. I had the replacement set tested by THREE agencies including most latterly Piper Cams in Kent UK. Tested personally by Technical Director and friend John Crabb who's words I have quoted.
For the record I carried out Vickers testing (in addition to Rockwell) although I knew that the test results could be easily correlated - and that is fact.
CAMS UNFIT FOR PURPOSE - TWICE. NO QUALITY PROTOCOLS IN PLACE FOR THIS FORMERLY RESPECTED COMPANY. Once is forgivable but twice is carelessness. Or worse - neglect.
My intuition - though I cannot prove this since Mr Bariani dodged the question from me - is that he is now having some items (if not all) made in China and has no quality control measures in place for those parts.
I warned Mr Bariani that I would make this post - since he doesn't take GCRE or me or my clients seriously or consider us to be of any importance.
As I said, my advice is don't buy from C&B. Very sad.
I shall NEVER trust them again AND I strongly advise you don't either. All I will say is BUYER-BEWARE.
GC
1. Cams bought from them for a Lancia 8v Integrale started to wear out within 10 minutes, metal debris all over the engine..
2. Tested for hardness by Rockwell method by my respected neighbours A Green Engineering Ltd by an ex-aerospace inspector - not heat-treated at all. Returned to C&B at MY cost! Results invalid according to owner of C&B - Vickers hardness testing method must only be used! Vickers testing done at cost to me! Results sent to C&B!
3. Total 7 months of trying to get C&B owner Alessandro Bariani to admit liability and pay for the entire engine rebuild
4. Grudging 'insurance payout' from C&B eventually that would not cover even 1/2 the cost of a total engine rebuild, removal from the car, re-installation, 3 days or more of the time of an expert consultant recommended by me - Nikola Radenkovich (founder of RP Labs) on site in Lancashire - having flown-in specially for the job, far less my time messing about doing emails to sort this mess out... Mr Bariani complained about how many emails he had to deal with to get the insurance payout. He even went so far as to say by email (I have all the records) that if we took C&B to court it would take YEARS to achieve a settlement. Not really what I want to hear from Italy's most 'respected' and oldest camshaft manufacturer - is it?
I myself would have covered the costs from my firm IMMEDIATELY. Fortunately - legally - I did not buy the cams, Tom Frame did. I am saddened that I recommended C&B but I trusted them. I no longer do nor ever will again
5. Replacement cams supplied by C&B as soft as raw En24T, colored like they were heat treated. They were not, They were about 32 HRc. Nowhere near the Rockwell or Vickers hardness specified to me by email by Mr Bariani. I had the replacement set tested by THREE agencies including most latterly Piper Cams in Kent UK. Tested personally by Technical Director and friend John Crabb who's words I have quoted.
For the record I carried out Vickers testing (in addition to Rockwell) although I knew that the test results could be easily correlated - and that is fact.
CAMS UNFIT FOR PURPOSE - TWICE. NO QUALITY PROTOCOLS IN PLACE FOR THIS FORMERLY RESPECTED COMPANY. Once is forgivable but twice is carelessness. Or worse - neglect.
My intuition - though I cannot prove this since Mr Bariani dodged the question from me - is that he is now having some items (if not all) made in China and has no quality control measures in place for those parts.
I warned Mr Bariani that I would make this post - since he doesn't take GCRE or me or my clients seriously or consider us to be of any importance.
As I said, my advice is don't buy from C&B. Very sad.
I shall NEVER trust them again AND I strongly advise you don't either. All I will say is BUYER-BEWARE.
GC