Fiat 128 Story

Competition engines and ancillaries - general discussion
Guy Croft
Site Admin
Posts: 5004
Joined: Sun Jun 18, 2006 9:31 am
Location: Lincoln, UK
Contact:

Re: Fiat 128 Story

Post by Guy Croft » Sat Mar 16, 2013 12:12 pm

Fantastic thread Phillippe, some real skill on show here!

G
Guy Croft, owner

philippe74
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2009 9:10 am
Location: Annecy - France
Contact:

Re: Fiat 128 Story

Post by philippe74 » Sun Mar 17, 2013 1:11 pm

Thank you for your comment !

Maybe this story could also help someone ...

Bye

Philippe

Guy Croft
Site Admin
Posts: 5004
Joined: Sun Jun 18, 2006 9:31 am
Location: Lincoln, UK
Contact:

Re: Fiat 128 Story

Post by Guy Croft » Sun Mar 17, 2013 1:54 pm

I am SURE that it will both encourage and help others Phillippe, I am told this all the time when folk join the forum.

The site gets well over a million hits a month...

G
Guy Croft, owner

miro-1980
Posts: 684
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2007 3:40 pm
Location: Warsaw suburb , Poland
Contact:

Re: Fiat 128 Story

Post by miro-1980 » Sat Mar 23, 2013 10:55 pm

Philippe,

Superb !

Really interesting and very detailed.

Great project and fantastic implementation.

Thank you.

MIro
www.131abarth.pl
GC_93

IVOR BORLAND
Posts: 7
Joined: Sat Sep 16, 2006 11:30 pm
Location: DONEGAL,IRELAND.
Contact:

Re: Fiat 128 Story

Post by IVOR BORLAND » Mon Mar 25, 2013 1:19 am

What can i say.Very good project,well built and thought through.Just a thought on shell prep.I had problems with the front strut tops on the shell in that they split at the very top ( the top centre where the strut top pokes through ) has tended to open up a bit.I fixed it by welding a steel plate onto the engine bay side off the tower.I do tarmac rallies so maybe lumps and bumps do not help. Do you compete in historic cat 3 eg Gp1 or Gp2.The car i have (128 3p ) was built to Gp2 spec and competed in the modified class in Ireland but when i tryed to enter historic cat 3 i was told i had to change the spec to Gp1 as that was all the car was hom in that time,1977.No one cam help me in finding out if i can use it in cat 3 historic.I know that 128 3p in Gp2 spec compet in europe (Germany) but no one will reply to emails that i sent to them.Do you know off any Gp2 128 3p's .SORRY for ranting on.Ivor.
Guy Book no 184.

miro-1980
Posts: 684
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2007 3:40 pm
Location: Warsaw suburb , Poland
Contact:

Re: Fiat 128 Story

Post by miro-1980 » Mon Mar 25, 2013 1:13 pm

Ivor,

I just happened to have studied MSA code and know that :

49.3. Historic Category 3 Rally Cars:
Includes cars registered and homologated in Groups 1, 2, 3 or 4 between 1 January 1975 and 31 December 1981.
Cars in Category 3 must comply with their Homologation forms and Appendix J of the 1981 FIA Yellow Book.


Fiat 128 3P were homologated as follows:

Hom # 5615; Gr 1; Model : Fiat 128 3 P – 1300; cc: 1290; homologation date: 01.01.1976
Hom # 5615; Gr A; Model : Fiat 128 3 P – 1300; cc: 1290; homologation date : 01.01.1976
Hom # 5614; Gr 1; Model: Fiat 128 3 P - 1100 ; cc: 1116; homologation date 01.01.1976
Hom # 5614; Gr A; Model: Fiat 128 3 P – 1100; cc; 1116 homologation date 01.01.1976


The only gr. B homologations for 128 were CLI and SE models (not the 3P model you have)

Hom # 249; Gr.B; Model : Fiat 128 CLI 1301; cc: 1302; homologation date: 01.08.1983
Hom # 285; Gr.B; Model : Fiat 128 SE – 1500; cc: 1499; homologation date: 01.07.1986

As MSA allows cars registered/ homologated up to and including in 1981. These cars would not be allowed due to production date, anyway.

Thus it seems quite clear : Fiat 128 3P is a gr 1/gr A car and must be in line with gr 1/A specs.

I do not know how it is in Germany but the same rules apply in Poland, except we follow the FIA Historic Rally Championship rules which include cars up to 1983 .

See detailed requirements for historic stage rally cars:
MSA Historic stage rallies regulations .doc
(54 KiB) Downloaded 77 times
Full text of MSA Code om 2013 MSA Yearbook look here : http://www.msauk.org/site/cms/contentCa ... tegory=640

However thr RAC (ROGER ALBERT CLARK) Rally Championship Regulations seem to be quite relaxed and would likely accept your car in category 6.

Series 6
Cars first registered up to 31st December 1986 complying with the MSA 2013
Technical Regulations, that have been built to comply with the MSA Technical
Regulation R49 but do not comply. These vehicles will be issued with Championship
paperwork RACVIF (VIF) vehicle identity forms will be issued for the Vehicle to
compete and will run to their homologation papers.


Miro
www.131abarth.pl
GC_93

IVOR BORLAND
Posts: 7
Joined: Sat Sep 16, 2006 11:30 pm
Location: DONEGAL,IRELAND.
Contact:

Re: Fiat 128 Story

Post by IVOR BORLAND » Sat Mar 30, 2013 12:54 am

Hi Miro. Thanks for the info.Interesting reading and i will look into that cat 6 class.Not a lot off people run a 128 3p so it is nice to find someone with a interest in them.I should have looked for a 128 sl coupe but they are so hard to find and i had the 3p since 1985 when i first rallied it.It looks that i will have to run gp 1 spec.You have a good base to build a car from which is a big help and saves a lot of work.Thanks ,Ivor.
Guy Book no 184.

philippe74
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2009 9:10 am
Location: Annecy - France
Contact:

Re: Fiat 128 Story

Post by philippe74 » Thu Apr 04, 2013 11:18 am

miro-1980 wrote:Philippe,

Superb !

Really interesting and very detailed.

Great project and fantastic implementation.

Thank you.

MIro

Thank you for your comment ****

philippe74
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2009 9:10 am
Location: Annecy - France
Contact:

Re: Fiat 128 Story

Post by philippe74 » Thu Apr 04, 2013 11:39 am

My 128 is prepared according to FIA regulations
january, 1 1976
I folllow appendix J according to the period

This type of car has been used in european races in this périod, so no difficulty for homologation.
It's true that it's easier if you want to prépare this car in group 1.

In the French hillclimb championship, there are four categories in the historic races.
Class 1 is for cars from the beginning to 1969
Category 2 is for cars from 1970 to 1975
Category 3 is for cars from 1976 until 1981
Category 4 is for cars and prototypes (regardless the year)
What is important is not the year of the car itself but the date of the FIA homologation form

For championship, points are dispached by category and by engine size, so you can find BMW, Porsche, Ford Alpine-Renault etc ..

If you want, I can post few pics of cars used during latest 2 years in this Championship ? Few of them are very nice ***

NB:
There is not only French in these races, but also Switzerland, Belgium, Luxembourg, German and English!
Example: Simon and Jane Harratt !!!

http://www.guepardonline.fr/images/gaze ... arratt.jpg

http://staticclub.caradisiac.com/privat ... 79-img.jpg

miro-1980
Posts: 684
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2007 3:40 pm
Location: Warsaw suburb , Poland
Contact:

Re: Fiat 128 Story

Post by miro-1980 » Sun Apr 28, 2013 9:52 pm

Philpppe.

I am looking for information on few aspects of historic car rallying in France. It would be best to get hold of original regulations in English ( if they exist)

1/ driver licensing for historic cars (what license is required ?, how one gets a license ? How to upgrade license to successive levels ?

2/ is there a historic stage rally license in France ?

3/ what are the cars' technical requirements/modifications allowed ?

4/ what is the cut off homologation date? is it 1981 ?

I would appreciate any link to information sources in English

Thanks

Miro
www.131abarth.pl
GC_93

philippe74
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2009 9:10 am
Location: Annecy - France
Contact:

Re: Fiat 128 Story

Post by philippe74 » Mon Apr 29, 2013 7:26 am

Hello

Give me a moment to prepare my answers :)

I'll make a document to explain as clearly as possible regulation and information to run in France in historical racing.

I will try to answer you as soon as possible

Regards

Philippe

miro-1980
Posts: 684
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2007 3:40 pm
Location: Warsaw suburb , Poland
Contact:

Re: Fiat 128 Story

Post by miro-1980 » Wed May 01, 2013 11:17 pm

Phillipe,

Thank you very much, Sir.

You are at true gentleman and sportsman !

Very kind of you.

Miro
www.131abarth.pl
GC_93

Guy Croft
Site Admin
Posts: 5004
Joined: Sun Jun 18, 2006 9:31 am
Location: Lincoln, UK
Contact:

Re: Fiat 128 Story

Post by Guy Croft » Sun May 05, 2013 12:31 am

super exchange, thanks respected members!!


G
Guy Croft, owner

philippe74
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2009 9:10 am
Location: Annecy - France
Contact:

Re: Fiat 128 Story

Post by philippe74 » Thu May 23, 2013 10:07 am

Sorry for the delay :(
I had so many things to do on my new car ..;

I will send you an answer this end of week

regards

Philippe

miro-1980
Posts: 684
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2007 3:40 pm
Location: Warsaw suburb , Poland
Contact:

Re: Fiat 128 Story

Post by miro-1980 » Thu May 23, 2013 6:03 pm

Philippe,

I really appreciate your help.

I am preparing an article to Polish monthly magazine of "Automobilista". It will cover British , French and hopefully German historic car rally regulations and hopefully drive our ASN Sports Commission to establish historic rally regulations for the 2013 season.

Thanks again for your help.

Miro

PS: I would be vary happy to run your name in the credits , if you agree to it.
www.131abarth.pl
GC_93

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest