'73 Fiat Abarth 124 Rally - project

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Rallyroller
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Re: '73 Fiat Abarth 124 Rally - project

Post by Rallyroller » Fri Mar 25, 2016 7:21 pm

Hi Miro

looking good.

As my Spider project is using a CS shell form USA, I have found a few little differences to the BS Euro spec

Check radiator and front chassis rails next to radiator- they are differnt on my CS shell than the BS.- radiator is not in centre of car!!!.

Nigel.
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miro-1980
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Re: '73 Fiat Abarth 124 Rally - project

Post by miro-1980 » Wed Mar 30, 2016 4:04 pm

Update to update - there is something at the end of destruction ( and it starts resembling a rally car) , surprise surprise ...:
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miro-1980
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Re: '73 Fiat Abarth 124 Rally - project

Post by miro-1980 » Fri Jun 24, 2016 12:10 am

Small picture update :

The cage is already welded in in acordance with Attachment K.

Few more elements in the process :

- Gear Reduction Starter for the 124 Spider from Allisson Automotive - in shipping.
- Abarth style bonnet clips - in shipping

The pictures you see below were taken before the safety cage was actually constructed and welded in. After a dry fitting , I decided to move front bar supports its elements slightly forwards ( by 2 cm ) and add a diagonal bar on the floor behind the seats. By now the cage is finished and looks really great ( no pictures yet)

Now we will install the full Abarth suspension and brakes and send it to the paint shop.

Once it comes back the work will concentrate on installing all interior parts ( dash, fire extinguisher system, protective foam and hard FIA foam bars on the cage etc and design the tank. We will actually weld a tank shape from a thin steel sheets and pass it onto the builder. Before this will take place we need all the tank parts ( plate from ATL , anti explosion material. etc.

Hopefully, I will drive this car to a rally still this season ...

Rgds

Miro
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Piotrek125p
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Re: '73 Fiat Abarth 124 Rally - project

Post by Piotrek125p » Sat Jun 25, 2016 2:40 pm

I am very happy that another 124 Abarth replica is building now in Poland.

Miro, are engine for this 124 will be build by GC ? I am very interested in 1840 8v Abarth engines, do you have any data of them ? Are you building a 1840 engine for this replica ?
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miro-1980
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Re: '73 Fiat Abarth 124 Rally - project

Post by miro-1980 » Sun Jun 26, 2016 10:40 am

Hi

It is just another such replica in Poland ...

It is:

- the on a 1973 /1839.3cc/ - not 2.0 engine
- based on a specific car (of Achim Warmbold -Jean Todt - 1973 Rally Poland winner)
- historically true (all livery and technical equipment is exactly as it was in 1973)
- on original Abarth suspension and Abarth brakes ( even the discs are original - NOS !)

Initially I will be running two Werber 44 IDF 20 but later will install a Kugelfischer inejection

The only differences from the original I know of will be the gearbox and wheels. I will be running homologated reinforced synchronized gearbox instead of the unsyncho box used originally and I will be using 7" CD 66 front / 8" CD 66 instead of 7" CD 66 front / 9" CD 66 ...

otherwise it is one of many here ...

RGDS

Miro

PS : Re Engine: We are trying to prove that there is a real benefit from being a member of GCRE and build the engine based on what we have learned here with GC guidance and support.
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miro-1980
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Re: '73 Fiat Abarth 124 Rally - project

Post by miro-1980 » Wed Aug 03, 2016 11:10 pm

WELL,
yet another pictorial update :

The chassis is being prepared for painting.
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Before this is done we must still design and install fly-off habndbrake ... and fit the seats.

The seats selected ( based on my excellent experience with Cobra ) are Sebring for the are driver and Suzuka for the co-pilot :
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And finally the dash plate was finally water cut and was dry fit today. I think it looks OK.
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Note: some of the gauges were fitted just to verify whole sizes and will be replaced with more vintage - if we can find them. If you have some old gauges spare ( oil temp / water temp / volt / i will be happy to trade for many spares I have .

A small centrally located underpanel will have the emergency switch ( 4 way fpasher , cut off switch and extinguisher system handle. There will be a long fuse plate under left center of the Halda and map lamp/Halda lighting switch on a small panel under the Heuer stop watch. The Heuer and the clock will have small red pilot lights for night reading . The dash will be satin black.

Incidentally the Russian tank clock has a phosphorous digits and hands and does indeed light up very nicely in total darkness - even w/o additional lighting.
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More to come


RGS

Miro
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Guy Croft
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Re: '73 Fiat Abarth 124 Rally - project

Post by Guy Croft » Thu Aug 04, 2016 11:01 am

if any of these are use MM you are welcome to them,

as to whether they work or not no idea, sorry! Niels van Buuren is getting all his 124 CSA ones checked and accurately calibrated with new senders where required (esp oil press & engine temp). New senders I guess it has to be Csaba Vandor at Autoricambi in the USA.

If you run an old oil pressure gauge and sender it will read garbage! I mention this for the general readership!

G
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miro-1980
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Re: '73 Fiat Abarth 124 Rally - project

Post by miro-1980 » Fri Aug 05, 2016 12:14 pm

Thanks GC

I could actually use these small ones . The large ones I have plenty of.
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I would like to stress how important is your remark about old gauges and old senders.
It is like having false sense of security. Whenever I use old gauges I use new senders ( non PRC made) and the gauges are professionally checked by a Polish Office of Measures and Weights lab and if necessary re-calibrated at Warsaw Polytechnic University lab.

These gauges are there not for show but to warn you of any developing engine problem. They have to be really reliable . In aviation they are often redundant , to make sure that of one brakes the other works amd gives you early warning.

Incidentally when you put such a beast together you'd better protect your investment ...
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Mine is in production ...

Rgds

Miro
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Guy Croft
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Re: '73 Fiat Abarth 124 Rally - project

Post by Guy Croft » Fri Aug 05, 2016 2:39 pm

OK Miro

glad they may be some use,

please email me your address

guy.croft@btconnect.com

G
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miro-1980
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Re: '73 Fiat Abarth 124 Rally - project

Post by miro-1980 » Fri Aug 05, 2016 3:20 pm

Thanks

Email sent.

Rgds

Miro
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Piotrek125p
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Re: '73 Fiat Abarth 124 Rally - project

Post by Piotrek125p » Sat Aug 06, 2016 4:51 pm

Where are you bought this pistons Miro ? Are they are from Supertech ?

These type of seats that you choose as a driver seat are very good in my opinion, but in historical car I think that seats without "ears" are better choice.
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Re: '73 Fiat Abarth 124 Rally - project

Post by Guy Croft » Sat Aug 06, 2016 7:17 pm

Listen, this is MY forum!

Let's have some loyalty for starving UK here you starving Poles!!

Damn Supertech. And Wossner too and all the damned GC copiers everywhere... incl Venolia and CP who no longer work for me for very good reasons and probably boast about still holding GC designs on file. I get an email and FB msg every week from people who have bought that kind of stuff and Catcams and Eagle Rods etc etc etc and then DARE to ask me how to use them!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Zero technical support, none. Not like GC. Design expertise of an ant. Of course you all want cheap.

If GC makes them, they can copy them!

But they cannot actually.

GC
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miro-1980
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Re: '73 Fiat Abarth 124 Rally - project

Post by miro-1980 » Sat Aug 06, 2016 8:29 pm

Dear Guy,

I do not know if my understanding is accurate , but I suspect I have an idea what you are referring to.

Pistons and their design.

I am by no means a pistons design expert, but if GC says so - it is so.

I also have no idea where are these pistons from. Mechanic sent a picture and I posted it.

I gather from GC reaction these look like GC designed pistons and these are copies of his design.

I know a lot of cars but I am not technical enough to tell one piston form another , and though I have seen such piston before here at the forum I do not know the intricacies of what goes into the piston design : is it the dome shape or material or anything else.

You, Guy, as the most effected ( and from whom the design was stolen ) know immediately when you see one.
I need to be instructed !

I assure you these pistons were bought legally and from a legally operating entity - if I am not mistaken from the US. But I do not even recognize any of the company names, which you mentioned (except for Cat, whose cams I had on the shelf )

I will get all this information who sold it to us and will transfer this info to you, Guy , off line.

You know, Guy, what I think of counterfeits.

If required I will try to obtain paperwork documenting the transaction for potential legal action against the supplier.

In terms of loyalty I believe I have proven many times my loyalty to GC and the forum , but unless I know of something , it is hard to guard against it.

Obviously no offense meant (!) or disloyalty for that matter.

If you patented the design or otherwise can prove your legal ownership of intellectual property of the piston design you should go after them. If not, just let us know who copies your work and who sells and I am sure the members of this forum will refrain form purchases form these dishonest merchants.

You know how these people are _ profit at any cost ( best if someone else's cost, too).

Sorry about it...

Please let us know here at the forum who these people are and I am sure we will all boycott them.

Rgds

Miro

PS: Please do not be mad at the "starving Poles" but at the "cheating Americans or British" , or whoever they are. We are victims of what they do as you are - not not culprits.

Side comments : I know patenting is a long and expensive process and the big fish typically win at the end anyway. So as you may have the claim to fame for designing them you probably do not have a paperwork stating such piston design is your legal exclusive property. To me it does not matter as honesty extends well beyond the realm of law and a cheat is a cheat. Infamy is his as no honest person (knowingly) does business with cheat.

Incidentally the intellectual property in the era if internet ( where everybody is using everybody else's work as his own) is almost impossible to protect. If it is out there and it is good - someone will copy it and sell as his own.

O tempora , o mores ... as Ancient Romans would put it.

Miro
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miro-1980
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Re: '73 Fiat Abarth 124 Rally - project

Post by miro-1980 » Sat Aug 06, 2016 8:39 pm

Peter , you wrote:

[quote=" These type of seats that you choose as a driver seat are very good in my opinion, but in historical car I think that seats without "ears" are better choice.[/quote]

Tell it to the crew after a major crash on a stage.

This is not a display replica but a fully rally worthy rally car.

I will be driving it and whereas I will not easily compromise on historical technical elements or non-safety related visual stuff , but when it comes to safety: no compromise whatsoever.

The question is simple really - if you have crash, which seat you would rather be in ...

Rgds

Miro
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Re: '73 Fiat Abarth 124 Rally - project

Post by Guy Croft » Sat Aug 06, 2016 8:47 pm

They aren't GC copies Miro or they would have offset VRs...

it's the concept they all love to copy, if GC makes this or that, there must be a market for them, so let's make some.

Those firms and people, from USA to Hungary to Australia, make me puke. Till I started working on TC units in 1990 there was virtually NOTHING for those engines, now every half-arsed twat is an expert.

Thanks all the same, I can't fight this relentless tide of shite.


GC
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