MSD 6A on Alfa romeo 33

[Brit01]

I recently purchased an MSD 6A module for my flat four.

It was a NOS, mint condition, never used unit. Took a risk but it paid off.

Did a quick test today, hooked it up in 15 mins using my original Bosch coil following Perry's instructions.

Started flawlessly. Thanks Perry!

Now just got to find a place to mount the unit. Think I will gave to move the coil and place the module next to the battery in the drier compartment there.

Once mounted then I will test it out on the road.

[Urbancamo]

Nice one Chris!

I'm very eager to hear what differences it makes compared to stock. Especially in dual carburated engine. I know that you are very meticulous so if there is some noticeable differences in rpm range and in different driving situations, you'll gonna notice that.

Is that stock Alfa ignition based on Hall effect or magnetic pickup? It might have been in some discussions before, but just now I couldn't find the information.

[Brit01]

Very nice piece isn't it?

Thanks yes I'm a bit obsessive with the running of my engine! lol
Your verbiage was much nicer though thanks.

It's magnetic pick up by the way.

Just got to think about it's location and possible re-wiring/extensions to reach the coil/distributor wires etc.
I think I need to go spade connector shopping. I want everything insulated properly here.


Though shame about the MSD coil. It's got stuck at the airport due to an ongoing strike (1 month now!) Over 50,000 kgs of post waiting to be sorted!!.

[Brit01]

All wired up in 30 minutes! Very neatly.

Started up and idled really nicely. I noticed more water and less smoke was coming from the exhaust which is a good sign of clean combustion.
The note of the engine sounded crisper and responded very very well to blips on the throttle.

Haven't tested it on the road yet but that will happen later today.

[Brit01]

Changing plugs to NGK 8 heat rating today.

Tried with the standard 7 and noticed the water temp increased faster than normal.
I know it was recommended to use a colder plug, didn't have any on hand yesterday and it was just a short town trip to make sure all the electrics were working properly.

Cold starting this morning was much easier. Idled nicely as Perry said, like a warm engine.

[Urbancamo]

Now I am even more interested!

Is there a clear change after cold star compared to OE Alfa ignition? As you know, no matter if it's 25 deg. C or more, after cold starting dual carbed engine it's real "thin" and runs pretty poorly many minutes until it warms up a bit.

I live here in North where winters are real cold and cold starting a dual carbed engine is really annoying. You have to "nurse" the engine pretty long time. When it runs just by it's own, you can jump out and take off all the snow and ice over your car!

I'm thinking 6AL-2 because it understands Hall-signal too.

[Brit01]

It wasn't a cold morning but there was an improvement for sure. Normally if I release the throttle it falls below 600 and stalls in the first 5 seconds or so. This morning perfect. Started her up and idled at 600 and warmed up to 800/850 without issues or any nursing.

The multi-spark is supposed to help the lean moments (start up/hard acceleration etc).

My wife always had issues 'nursing' it until it warms up. Hope this assists her somewhat.

Wasn't so cold this morning though. We may have some cold nights in the coming days but a noticeable change I must say (with the electric pump also!) That helps a lot I think.


Also nothing related with performance but the sound from the distributor cap/rotor is very different. You can hear a clear high speed ticking sound. I guess that is the longer duration sparks as the rotor turns.

[Brit01]

What I have noticed is that the engine is running hotter with the MSD. Well the water temp for now. But it was only a 20 min drive and the oil wasn't up to working temp.

Don't know if this is a bad sign or something is wrong.

Also when I changed to a colder plug I had to adjust the idling. It started at around 600 and didn't increase much. Only to about 650/700 when hot which was too low.
Before with the hotter plug it idled cold at 600 and when hot 800/850 or so.

What is better?

One thing:

colder plug 0.7mm gap
normal plug(7) 0.6mm gap

[Brit01]

I actually retarded the timing a little more today.
Pushed it hard this morning and detected a little pinging.

The static timing was set at behind the 8 degree mark but at high revs, 4500 it passed the second advanced timing mark.

So I retarded it a little more to prevent it advancing past the final mark on the flywheel.

Also I think I need to go down a size in idles again. Getting too much black soot coming out of the exhaust pipe even though I get good acceleration and no hesitation.
Maybe the smaller idles will work better with the msd ignition.

[Brit01]

I'm surprised but I think the MSD has affected the timing somewhat.

I need to retard it more. Hesitates to crank on the first turning of the key.
Pings a little under very hard acceleration still.
Timing at 4500 rpm is on the mark at 34 degrees but TDC is just about less than 7 degrees.

More retard I guess.

Oil temps stable but water tends to heat up quickly when idling after a long run at higher speeds.

[Brit01]

Is it true that if the static timing is too retarded the engine heats up very quickly at idle? Heating up the valves and exhaust manifold transferring this heat to the coolant and this is where you see your temperature gauge increase quickly at idle.

[Biancorally]

Hi,
yes, it's true retarding the static timing will increase considerably the exhaust temperature during the cold start phase.
Already often seen on older American model. Two vacuum cans at Distributor, one for advance and one for retarded ignition.

Regards

Daniel

[Brit01]

So I think here I'm having an issue with the initial timing being too low and max timing causing detonation.

Could be various things.

-Too hot plugs for MSD
-New air filters dragging in hot air/and or making the mixture too lean
-Weak springs/broken/sticking on distributor

[Brit01]

I think I will disconnect the MSD and compare the stock with the same timing.

edit: I will try a colder plug first.

MSD even recommend using a gap between 1.25 and 1.5 mm. This seems excessively wide. Stock gap for my Alfa is 0.6mm!!

[Brit01]

Nope still getting detonation!!!

Plugs showed no signs of lean mixtures.

I will disconnect the unit and compare it with stock ignition next.

Maybe the timing is out on the MSD or it's not working well with the stock coil or something.

Could of course be the distributor weights/springs but this is a process of elimination so one thing at a time.