Sump too low!

[MinorTC]

I have finally got my Fiat 2-litre twin-cam engined Minor through its MOT. However, I have (literally) hit the snag of the sump being very low - only about 3" from the road at the lowest point (the front 8 inches or so of the sump pan), despite the car being on standard suspension ride height.

Was/is there a sump available with a lower profile?

[Guy Croft]

No. The size of the oil pump and its pickup is the problem. You will save 3/4" tops with a big-wing conversion, same is true of the Argenta one which looks like a 'big wing' item but has no baffling.

You could dry-sump but more often than not there is a cross-member somewhere which can cause problems in itself with the design of the pan and it's a costly solution.

If you don't have a sump guard you'd better get busy on one.

G

[MinorTC]

Thanks, Guy! Looks like I'll have to get busy fabricating that sump guard then...

[MartinB]

Don't forget that the base of the bellhousing is similar height from the road as the standard sump therefore even with a shallower sump you will still most likely have ground clearance issues with the gearbox/bellhousing. If you only have 3" ground clearance with your Minor at standard ride height, I think you might have some scope to raise the engine in the car a bit.

I have been through various sump versions over the years on my Minor (standard 2 litre one, then modified Argenta and currently dry sump), even now the gearbox & bellhousing is the ground clearance issue on mine (along with the exhaust).

Martin

[Guy Croft]

Very good point Martin!

Any chance of some photos of your car in current trim?

Would enjoy that,

G

[MartinB]

Guy, I have been struggling to find some photos without any potential copyright issues, I haven't got any later than 2007 either, the last time I competed with it! Here are a few (the best I could find) from that year!

Waiting to go out for a timed run at a sprint (on slicks)

Morris.JPG (231.81 KiB) Viewed 9578 times

Morris engine.JPG (191.53 KiB) Viewed 9578 times

On road tyres

Morris Side.JPG (194.03 KiB) Viewed 9578 times

I realise now that I probably haven't driven the Morris for nearly two years or even started it up for over a year, I hope to get it out in 2011 for a trackday or two though. It was starting to become a bit of a handfull when pushing really hard (wringing its neck really) on hillclimbs and sprints, the real eye opener was when I got into a tank slapper at 135 mph under braking and thought I was going off in a very big, car destroying, way, luckily I managed to still make the corner after turning it into more of a scandanavian flick, got through the corner at 110 mph! Basically I had reached the limit of what the car could do and was going way over it. The engine can produce way more power than it has but the car won't be able to use it.

I have been a bit side tracked from the Morris for the last three years, seduced by the darkside of motorcycle power and have been circuit racing this:

Radical side.JPG (98.81 KiB) Viewed 9578 times

Radical Rear.JPG (259.64 KiB) Viewed 9578 times

I have been developing the aerodynamics on the Radical (it is a clubsport which didn't have the wing etc) and am currently developing the engine of course (turbocharged ZZR1200).

Regards

Martin

[MinorTC]

Well, I think I have hopefully solved the sump issue, by raising the car up by one spline (1.5") on the front torsion bars - it was lowered, after all. So, it's now back to standard ride height, giving around 6" of sump clearance.

[dp]

Agree with all of above. I've fiddled around with height of the front trying to resolve the same problem and come to the conclusion that short of hydraulic suspension a guard is the way to go.

One thing I've noticed is that, for a given amount of lowering at the front wheels, bashing is worse if the back isn't lowered a similar amount since the front of the engine is angled down further.

I also have no silencers between the front and back wheels as there is little room and they get ripped over speed humps. Rather I fitted a straight pipe to the rear of the car, as high as possible, 90 degree bend and two jetexes right to left behind the petrol tank. Far from idea from a flow point of view but the best compromise I could achieve.

I've dug up some pictures of what I knocked up last year out of a piece of aluminium plate.

[MinorTC]

Nice work, dp! Agree with you on the lowering of both front and rear; mine was just lowered at the front by the previous owner, presumably going for a 'hot rod' look, which to my mind, was a bit naff - I prefer the 'sleeper' look, or at least, to have it all reasonably on the level.

He also fitted a side-exit exhaust that uses a pair of Ford silencers, which so far, hasn't hit anything, and sounds quite sweet too! :)

Here's pics of when I removed it to modify it to fit the revised tubular manifold:

[dp]

Yours looks just great completely stock, no clue as to what's going on in the engine bay. Are those standard Minors wheels or Morris Oxfords, or banded?

[MinorTC]

Thanks! The rear wheels are early MGB 12-hole 5J ones with 165x14 tyres as it has an MGB tube rear axle, fronts are standard Minor ones, with 145x14 tyres.

Snag with this of course, is that the rear PCD is 4.5" while the front is 4", so I'll have to drill out a wheel with an extra set of holes to use as a spare!

I'd like to change the front Marina hubs to Morris/Marina 575 van ones, which have the 4.5" PCD, but they are hard to come by...

[dp]

I'm sure someone was re-manufacturing the van wheels (EP917) ask or search on the Minor websites.

[MinorTC]

Hi dp,

I certainly would like van wheels on the front. In fact, I used to have a full set, but foolishly lent out 3 to my brother to prop a car bodyshell on and they got pinched and probably weighed in for a fiver, so now I only have the one :(

I've even seen the odd one on E-b*y go for as much as £102 recently! (Item no. 300528305314)